From food truck to empire: Nick Sanford of Toss & Fire Pizza

Nick Sanford is the founder of Toss & Fire Wood-Fired Pizza, which began as a food trailer in 2015 and has since expanded to include multiple locations and trucks across Central New York. Known for creative pies like the 'Cuse Salt Potato Pizza, Sanford has built a loyal following for his wood-fired creations.

Check out Nick’s full video interview or read the transcript below to gain his insights for both new and seasoned shop owners.

Sabrina D’Alessandro:

I'm Sabrina. I'm here with Slice. And today I have in the hot seat… 

Nick Sanford:

Nick Sanford from Toss & Fire Pizza. 

Sabrina: 

And Nick, where are you guys located? 

Nick:

We're located in central New York. Syracuse area. 

Sabrina: 

Very nice. And how did you start Toss & Fire?

Nick:

So we started with a mobile, pull-behind trailer. So it's just like a little oven on a trailer. And we used to kind of take it around to go to different events — farmers markets, festivals, music concerts and stuff like that. 

Sabrina: 

So much fun. What an awesome environment that you guys were in. 

Let's talk about marketing. Who handles your marketing? 

Nick:

So I do most of it. You know, I've worked with different companies over the years and I've had. I have a really good photographer. I have people who help me with video work. I try to do my own stuff where I can. If I'm not good enough at it, I'm all about using someone who's much better than me to do it. But, we also do social media. A lot of visual stuff. Trying to get more into the video that's more of what's like kind of upcoming from what I can see. 

And then we do some of the traditional stuff too. We'll do like a menu mailing maybe once a year and do social media paid ads. We're fortunate there's a lot of word of mouth. Works well for us as well. 

Sabrina:

And which social media platforms do you feel like gets the most people through the door for you? 

Nick:

I think it's Instagram and Facebook. Facebook has been on a downward trend for a long time for us, or I think in general. I still think that the millennial-like group of customers is still there, but they're still talking to friends and family. They're still looking at feeds, they're seeing ads, they're following businesses that they like. So, we've had a lot of success with that. And we have our biggest following there. So it's worked out. 

Sabrina: 

That's awesome. And Nick, you talked about the different types of food trucks and catering places that you did. What has worked well for you and what maybe you would not do again from what you've learned?

Nick: 

We've done every kind of event with the food trucks. When we started it was just get our name out there and go wherever we could go.  I found out tha going to a Little League park doesn't work well for pizza, but it might work really well for a  hot dog cart. But a brewery works really well for pizza. 

And, catering — we'll cater anything. So if you've got a wedding or graduation or a birthday corporate event, I think pizza can fit in well to any of that.

Sabrina: 

And for someone who's looking to dabble in the catering space, where would you recommend that they start and how do they balance that with a brick and mortar shop? 

Nick: 

 I think the mobile business is my favorite part of this business that I've been doing the last ten years. The best way I was able to get into catering was being out there for people to try our food.

Once they started trying the food, they saw the trailer and then our truck. We went from trailer to truck. They wanted to have that truck at their event. They wanted to. Oh, that'd be a really cool idea for a wedding. That'd be a really cool idea for a corporate ad or whatever. 

That's kind of how we started. We got out there, we got the farmers markets. Stuff like that was great to meet people. Going to the breweries was great to meet people. You never know when someone's like in the market, booking a caterer. Like, they could just be having a night out at a brewery and they're like, wow, that's really great for my wedding. And then all of a sudden, they're booking you for the wedding. 

Sabrina: 

That's awesome. And for someone who's looking to start their business, would you recommend a food truck or brick and mortar?

Nick: 

I’m always an advocate for food trucks. But I do think it's market specific. Like we were fortunate when we started almost ten years ago that there were like four food trucks in Syracuse, like it was. It was basically like the birth of the food truck scene there. And I think there's well over 100 food trucks operating in our market now. So that gave us a head start. Got us to the market early. We met clients early. We became the standard of one of the standards of what's being offered in that area. So I think that that was huge for us. So I think market research is really important when it comes to deciding what you want to do.

But it's a lower cost option to get started. It's more approachable to do it. Like, especially now with the ovens that people like, like the Gozney, the Oonies and stuff. A lot of people start out with pop ups and stuff like that. I think it's a really good way to get going.

Sabrina

And I guess for those that you're catering events for, do you typically see repeat clients or are they pretty much all new people?

Nick: 

So it depends. I mean like corporate clients, we'll deal with a lot of the same corporate clients. Pepsi might hire us once a year for a party or some various small corporations that are in the area.

Weddings are generally one and done, but that doesn't mean that they won't hire us for a child's birthday party a couple of years later or whatever, whatever it may be. They might say you were great to work with for this, so we're hiring you for this. 

I've had a family that hired us for different graduation parties over the last ten years. As all their kids graduated high school, they would have us come out and do that party. So I think that every time you do a party, there's a potential connection to somebody who needs catering. So everything kind of snowballed from there. 

Sabrina: 

Great. That's great. And what makes you guys at Toss and Fire stand out from the crowd?

Nick: 

I think that we offer a lot of unique products. I've always kind of looked at that pizza as like a blank canvas. You can put anything on it. And when we started, we were one of the first places doing some really unique different combinations. But we created a salt potato pizza in Syracuse, which is like a Syracuse staple item, which nobody was doing at the time, which is our best seller. And, you know, we've always, always tried to innovate and be new and exciting and, and offer something that people are excited to try. 

Sabrina: 

You guys are paving the way for sure, Nick.

In terms of your story, what have you sacrificed to be where you are? To really make it in the pizza industry? 

Nick: 

Anytime you're building any type of business, but especially a restaurant business,  it's a 24/7s, like it's your even when you're not there, you're there and you're dealing with something or you're or check in on something or whatever it is.

I'm fortunate that I have a family that's extremely understanding. And I have three beautiful children and an amazing wife that support what I do. And I love pizza. And, but there's definitely days where it can be frustrating to have to be pulled away from something you're doing, or have to take a phone call when you're trying to enjoy a day off or whatever it may be.

I think like anything in life, it's all about balance. And, I try to do my best to balance it. 

Sabrina: 

And if you can give a new shop owner one piece of advice before they're getting started, what would you tell your younger self or what would you tell them? 

Nick: 

I would tell them that you can never learn enough. You can never talk to enough people. You can never. Everybody has different perspectives and experiences they've been through. You know, I've been coming to Pizza Expo and Pizza Expo events for the last seven/eight years. And I've always taken something out of it, whether it's a conversation I had with another operator from somewhere else in the country or a vendor that gave me information that I thought was really interesting, or a product that I wanted to try.

So I think that you could never know enough information and research, read, learn, talk. Try to become as knowledgeable as you can because once you're in it, you're in it. It's good to have some kind of base of knowledge.

Sabrina:

It's a way of life. It's not just a job. Right? 

Nick: 

For sure. 

Sabrina: 

Well, thank you so much for talking to Slice today, for being with us. We're so happy to have you on our mini shop talk series. 

Nick: 

Absolutely.